SparkyLinux Forums

Development => Suggestions => Topic started by: The Black Pig on February 01, 2016, 06:01:18 pm

Title: Mini iso
Post by: The Black Pig on February 01, 2016, 06:01:18 pm
Talking to Pavroo in our facebook group https://www.facebook.com/groups/SparkyLinux/ I said would be nice if we had a distro that was mini so that peopl could add whatever programs they fancied.
As this is a personnel thing He suggested asking members what they would like on it. The above is a suggested list , if you think of something else post here.
Title: Re: Mini iso
Post by: Lizzie on February 01, 2016, 06:27:42 pm
I suggest adding a terminal - maybe xfce terminal, or gnome terminal
Title: Re: Mini iso
Post by: The Black Pig on February 01, 2016, 07:25:08 pm
I suggest adding a terminal - maybe xfce terminal, or gnome terminal
Done , have you voted?
Title: Re: Mini iso
Post by: seppalta on February 01, 2016, 10:31:43 pm
I think you need a web browser and a window manager.  I vote for iceweasel and openbox.  For image viewer,  mirage is lightweight and offers some editing tools,  for pdf viewer,  xournal offers some editing tools in addition to viewing, and for terminal, lxterminal or sakura are preferable to xfce4-terminal.

How will this iso be different from the current Sparky-Base-Openbox?
Title: Re: Mini iso
Post by: The Black Pig on February 02, 2016, 04:23:36 pm
I think you need a web browser and a window manager.  I vote for iceweasel and openbox.  For image viewer,  mirage is lightweight and offers some editing tools,  for pdf viewer,  xournal offers some editing tools in addition to viewing, and for terminal, lxterminal or sakura are preferable to xfce4-terminal.

How will this iso be different from the current Sparky-Base-Openbox?
The latest (4.2) Openbox has more applications than the JWM 4.1 version , and you haven't voted lol
Title: Re: Mini iso
Post by: paxmark1 on February 03, 2016, 12:28:24 am
I have been a big fan of openbox for years, but it will probably not be ported to wayland.  lxqt is making the move to xfwm4 for wayland compatibility.  I have on the back burner how to add my #! shortcut key strokes to xfwm4. 

For getting info easily for forum postings and also when asked on some irc channels I would recommend inxi to be automatically installed. 

Another part of the equation for a mini-iso is what language and libraries are drawn in by the chosen browser, editor, etc., etc. If one pulls in gtk-2, another gtk-3 and another qt4, qt5, python 2 and 3,  etc.  that adds up. 

And of course there is the plumbing in systemd.  systemd-timesyncd.service is working well now and makes ntp not needed.  There are several other newish things in systemd to simplify and prune programs.  Eliminating automatic installation of bluetooh and raid - mdadm is also an option. 

Display manager.  slim is not being kept up to date.  lightdm or sddm are both candidates, sddm is being designed to transition to wayland easily. 

tint2 is getting more development again, but the simplicity of plank is quite elegant. 

Kernels get upgraded fairly regular in testing.  Although it is not debian per se, the siduction package of "kernel-remover"  is by far the easiest and safest route I know of for managing how many kernels I have. 

Peace out,



Title: Re: Mini iso
Post by: grandadruss on February 06, 2016, 12:42:53 am
Display Manager, Window Manager, Package Manager, Terminal, Text Editor, Web Browser. And a Network Manager.
I install LightDM, i3WM, Synaptic, Lxterminal, Leafpad, Qupzilla and NetworkManager onto CLI iso.
Title: Re: Mini iso
Post by: balloon on February 06, 2016, 04:54:58 am
I also looked at Facebook group.
I do not know the intention of the Mini ISO. Why are you trying to make it?
Because I do not know it, the action will not be able to do anything.
Title: Re: Mini iso
Post by: pavroo on February 06, 2016, 03:44:44 pm
As I spoke with John (The Black Pig) before, he asked about as small as possible iso image.
After a hard drive installation, you can install all the software you like and set the system yourself, without uninstalling applications which are already pre-installed on the standard iso images.

I'd like to join the disscussion and add my point of view.
As many people as many options. it could be difficult to find a compromise, specially with the default mini iso desktop.
My suggestion is:
1. No desktop, no graphical server, it could be based on cli edition.
2. Adding additional scripts so the cli installer will be able to install a specific, your favorite desktop (a window manager or a desktop environment) with very basic applications.
It can be done via meta-packages, such as: sparky-jwm-desktop which will install (for example, as you suggest):
- graphical server
- window manager (or desktop environment in as small settings as possible)
- terminal emulator
- web browser
- login manager (lightdm as default , sddm for plasma)
- a few tools for desktop configuration
- network-manager (-gnome for all desktops/ -kde for plasma)
- a text editor

To help managing network connection in the cli edition, I can enclose ceni, the nurses based cli network manager.
The core system will be installed from the iso (offline) as it's managing now.
The additional desktop will be installed from sparky and debian server (online installation) if the internet connection will be made before starting the installation process.
If you will not install any desktop, you can do it after the system reboot from the hard drive and connectiong to the network, just installing a sparky meta package.
The package lists you propose could be used to create separate meta packages so will automate installation of any desktop (with basic settings only).

I spent the last two days improving the old installer, so it supports efi machines too (not in repos yet) so can be used on bios and efi machines now.
Title: Re: Mini iso
Post by: The Black Pig on February 06, 2016, 04:58:15 pm
Yup , I'm not always very good at putting My thoughts down in the proper manor but I think pavroo your idea for adapting the CLI version
'ticks all the boxes'   ;)
Title: Re: Mini iso
Post by: The Black Pig on February 06, 2016, 05:13:54 pm
Strange , been trawling the website and and according to this page - http://sparkylinux.org/sparkylinux-4-0-base-cli-editions/ we already have these mini editions

Quote "SparkyLinux 4.0 Base and CLI Editions are available to download.

Sparky 4 is based on and fully compatible with Debian testing 9 “Stretch”.

Base Edition editions feature the core system, a lightweight desktop, wireless drivers and a few applications only.

The new iso images of Base Edition are available in 3 flavors, such as :
– Enlightenment (0.19.5)
– JWM
– Openbox

CLI Edition (Command Line Interface) features the core system, wireless drivers and a few, text mode applications." Unquote
However they don't appear on the download pages ?Maybe restorer the link will solve it ?
Title: Re: Mini iso
Post by: pavroo on February 06, 2016, 05:18:14 pm
Still there is sparky 4.2 openbox and enlightenment with as small set of apps as possible.

There is another point of matter with the mini iso.
It is not possible to put the core system, drivers, tiny window manager on a 700 mb iso image to let install it on old machines without DVD drive.
The cli image is still smaller that 700 mb.

Edit:
As the latest poll showed that cli and jwm are not too popular, I did not relese them as 4.2 image.
Title: Re: Mini iso
Post by: balloon on February 07, 2016, 01:58:02 am
If you add a package, Many of the package it is not to become a Sparky own design, It Debian of content is reflected.
and Debian exists netinst ISO, has become possible such a thing.
Sparky is whether there is really need to create a Mini ISO, we need to discuss more.
Title: Re: Mini iso
Post by: DennisD on February 09, 2016, 08:07:22 pm
I have been using the Openbox version. My vote would be to base the mini.iso on it, but trim the fat. As such, include only:
Session Manager (Sparky Branded)
Window Manager(openbox) (Sparky Branded)
Network Manager
Tint2 (tasks, systray, time and network manager configured)
File Manager (PCmanFM)
Web Browser
Text Editor
Terminal Emulator
Sparky-Screenshot
Sparky-Conky (maybe rebranded, though I am partial to the BunsenLabs Conky. It is what I use now to display my system specs and shortcuts.)

anything else can be added through apt.

IMHO this would give a good, solid graphical base while still being very minimal. Maybe even devote a wiki page to just the Mini.iso with a quick start section, how to edit tint2 and openbox, etc.

Just my 2 cents.

Title: Re: Mini iso
Post by: partsman on March 18, 2016, 04:24:26 am
Hi all  :)

I realize I am new here so I don't want to step on toes here !  ;)
With that said ! The following is just some random thoughts  ;D

Would it be possible "without adding much bloat to the ISO"
Have a a WM that is small but easy to use and still somewhat visually stimulating such as JWM
And have something like in sparky APTus to simply install a different WM and comletely remove the base and/or the previous WM ?
"All the config file etc.

The only reason I say this is because not everyone these days is a guru  ;)
And I am afraid that only having command line might scare off someone new to linux !

Personally I prefer Xfce4 but we are not all the same ! Linux is about choice !
And in my opinion xfce4 is not minimal  ;D
For what its worth here is a nice WM comparison that makes a good read  ;)
https://l3net.wordpress.com/2013/03/17/a-memory-comparison-of-light-linux-desktops/ (https://l3net.wordpress.com/2013/03/17/a-memory-comparison-of-light-linux-desktops/)

Regardless of what goes into it I will be ready and waiting to test !  ;)
Thanks all  :)
Title: Re: Mini iso
Post by: pavroo on March 19, 2016, 05:25:03 pm
Hi partsman

The JWM is really fast and lightweight but there are to many Sparky spins exist to make another one.
Anyway the JWM can be installed with Sparky "look and feel" using the minimal iso now:
http://sparkylinux.org/multi-desktop-installer/

This is a good idea to add an option of desktop installation to APTus.
I even start working with that a year ago, but dropped it, so it still is on my local drive.
I was too busy than to finish it, but now, there are desktop meta packages exist (built for the minimal iso) so shoud be easy to add it to APTus soon.
Title: Re: Mini iso
Post by: partsman on March 24, 2016, 05:59:18 pm
Hello all  :)
@pavroo
Thanks I did take the min iso for a spin via live usb !  ;)
Very nice very well done !
Also thanks for the info about JWM !
And yes adding the desktop installer to APTus is good !
I have another box a may install this on but I need to spend some time
moving some files around on the hard drive before hand !

As far as my 64bit xfce4 install I am very happy with so going to leave it alone !
My other box is running LMDE2 and its begging for some sparky !  ;D

And like I said the former was merely just random thoughts  ;)
Thanks to all here who help make sparky possible !  ;)
Very nice indeed !  :)
Title: Re: Mini iso
Post by: cooler on June 30, 2016, 08:14:22 am
Hello
My first post here.. greetings from Romania.
I like very much the idea of a minimal ISO. I'm a long time Bodhi Linux user and like their approach to minimalism. I also like Enlightenment. It's too bad you dropped the Enlightenment ISO but I understand it's not really mainstream.
However I find your Minimal GUI really overweight with a lot of unnecessary software. So maybe can you create a micro ISO with only synaptic, a file manager (double commander is really cool and has lots of extra) and a terminal and let the users choose what they want?! Just a suggestion... and frankly openbox is not that small/efficient. I think for instance you could do a Enlightenment desktop and if the user chooses to install another DE you could make an option to uninstall Enlightenment completely after the new DE is installed.
Title: Re: Mini iso
Post by: Murdock2525 on August 21, 2021, 10:11:05 pm
Put whatever you want. I can wipe it later
I love aptus, synaptic. I need nothing more. Lxterm,anything is fine.KISS
Keep fireFarce and Liberated office away from a "mini" iso
Start with a simple WM even a newb can handle. Openbox or a mildly Pavvood AwesomeWM would be fine
Openbox 'Noir" is the finest pre figged WM I have ever encountered.
Flawless